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Krissy
Krissy
Posts: 15430
Joined: 8th Jul 2008
Location: USA
quotePosted at 16:07 on 30th September 2010

Sue...a DNR is a "document" stating that the patient is not be resuscitated. "Do Not Resucitate". It's leagally binding.

Jason...it's very much what animals do. They go off on their own to die. Makes sense. Death I suppose could be a beautiful thing but for us left behind its fearful and sad.

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cathyml
cathyml
Posts: 23275
Joined: 25th Jan 2010
Location: South Africa
quotePosted at 16:43 on 30th September 2010

What a horrifying thought that if I had, to all intents and purposes, "died", someone would actually decide for me that it was not to be!!

I can understand resucitation if the person is young or in an accident but over 70's whose quality of life is already seriously impaired, then I find it immoral for someone else to choose  to damage me more in an attempt to return me to an even worse quality of life, making me a bigger burden on the nursing staff/doctors/care facility/family.  We allow animals more dignity in death!

In fact I think I would go further and ban it if the elderly person is in a nursing home/frail care/hospice etc.

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Rob Faleer
Rob Faleer
Posts: 703
Joined: 10th Jun 2005
Location: USA
quotePosted at 16:53 on 30th September 2010

Both of my frail, ailing parents have very specific DNR documents. Though they live with me and my wife, they spend some of the time with my brother in Chicago. We both have medical power of attorney for my parents, both of us have discussed my parents' wishes with them at length and my brother and I are completely on the same page when it comes to making that difficult decision (probably in the very near future for at least one of them). My father-in-law also had a DNR document to which my wife and I adhered. He had advanced Alzheimer's Disease and his death, with family surrounding his bed, was quiet, dignified and as easy a passage as one could wish.

I also have a DNR document and I am listed as an organ donor. To me, when it comes to catastrophic illness, quality of life and the possiblity of a "good" death trumps being kept "alive" via machine. The way my father-in-law left this existence is the way I would like to go.



Edited by: Rob Faleer at:30th September 2010 20:27
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Shaun Wilson
Shaun Wilson
Posts: 1832
Joined: 23rd Dec 2009
Location: UK
quotePosted at 20:25 on 30th September 2010

if that happen to me then for me it would have to be DNAR  do not attempt rescusitation.

just let me go iam shore i no a song about that ?? 

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Urmimala Singh
Urmimala Singh
Posts: 655
Joined: 8th Sep 2009
Location: India
quotePosted at 06:54 on 1st October 2010

If the person concerned is well into old age and in poor health I see no point in unnecessarily prolonging his/her misery.

In a country like India there is another angle.Recently the father of one person in my office fell very seriously ill with several complications.For two weeks the hospital kept him in and tried all sorts of treatments.My colleague had to spend money he could ill afford all the time knowing it would not help.At the end of it all his father passed away (as expected).I find this wholly unethical on the part of the doctors and the hospital.

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cathyml
cathyml
Posts: 23275
Joined: 25th Jan 2010
Location: South Africa
quotePosted at 08:12 on 1st October 2010

That is a good point Urmi!  In countries without National Health (or even with it), the prolonging of life is extremely expensive and very hard on the families both financially and emotionally and physically.

Mike's recent stay in hospital cost in the region of R160 000.00, if we were not fortunate enough to have been paying into Medical Aid (Hospital Insurance) we would have had to sell the house to pay the bills!!!

If that money had been spent without hope of survival, or the quality of life would have been seriously affected requiring permanent care, then it does seem as though either the patient is a guinea pig to try various treatments on, or it is a money-making raquet.  Either way it is totally unacceptable!

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Ron Brind
Ron Brind
Posts: 19041
Joined: 26th Oct 2003
Location: England
quotePosted at 13:12 on 1st October 2010

Good and important thread Jason. Fact is, we seem not to want what you professionals have to offer when we are old, say 70's plus! The case you describe is sad but it had an inevitable end, as indeed we all do.

I remember my mother having had a stroke and being totally unable to move. Majority of the family told the hospital do not resuscitate, but along comes a brother, who lived nowhere near her, and visited even less who said yes she must be resuscitated. The hospital had no choice but to bring her back to a vegetable state where she 'hung on' for 18 months! Terrible, and all because of one family member having a different opinion. I know my mother would not have wanted that, and I certainly would not!

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cathyml
cathyml
Posts: 23275
Joined: 25th Jan 2010
Location: South Africa
quotePosted at 14:41 on 1st October 2010
That is so sad Ron! What happened to majority vote ???
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Barbara Shoemaker
Barbara Shoemaker
Posts: 1764
Joined: 4th Jan 2008
Location: USA
quotePosted at 14:46 on 1st October 2010
My mother, 78 with a number of health issues, has a living will/DNR document under which no extraordinary measures are to be taken to prolong her life.  I totally respect that.  As Christians, we also believe that death is not the end and that our spirits are passing on to a much more wonderful eternal life.  So the fear factor is taken out of the equation.  If I'm in such a state that my body can't breathe on its own, please do not connect me to a machine for that purpose!  It only creates another wrenching decision of when to "pull the plug".  After a person has lived a long life or has endured much pain, illness and/or hardship, they should be allowed to look forward to the one final dignity of a peaceful passing.
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Rob Faleer
Rob Faleer
Posts: 703
Joined: 10th Jun 2005
Location: USA
quotePosted at 14:51 on 1st October 2010
That's why having one or two like-minded relatives with an iron-clad medical power of attorney who are charged with carrying out the wishes of their loved one is so vitally important! The selfish wishes of detached relatives can be immediately scuppered in favor of the detailed instructions and rights of the patient.
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