White people are now the minority in Leicester!

I feel that I can no longer remain silent! I have become increasingly dismayed and appalled with the ugly tone that this and some posts in other forum threads have exhibited. Has POE become a forum for white supremacist rants? Has POE opened a new front for the BNP? 

Be very, very careful when it comes to supporting the BNP, Ron. If you pay close attention, you might just hear the faint echoes of SA and SS jackboots, or catch a whiff of burning books (Koran? Talmud?), or hear ever so faintly the breaking glass of Kristallnacht. Also keep in mind that Nick Griffin is an unapologetic Holocaust denier--this from the BBC:

"Between 1995 and 1997, Nick Griffin edited 'The Rune'. Griffin referred to the Holocaust as a "Holohoax". In 1998 Nick Griffin said, 'I am well aware that the orthodox opinion is that 6 million Jews were gassed and cremated and turned into lampshades. Orthodox opinion also once held that the Earth was flat... I have reached the conclusion that the "extermination" tale is a mixture of Allied wartime propaganda, extremely profitable lie, and latter witch-hysteria.'"

Do any of you reading this forum post believe that the Holocaust was an elaborate hoax? If so, it’s a shame that you cannot talk to one of my great uncle's Latvian Jewish relatives who survived the horrors of the Kaiserwald work camp near Riga (she's dead now). She had a perfectly lovely number tattoo placed on her arm courtesy of SS Obersturmfuhrer Zauer—a tattoo that she refused to hide after her liberation. Did my great-uncle's cousin make this up as she told her story, as she wept for her murdered family? Did she tattoo herself? Oh, those crafty Jews! But hey, they didn’t belong in Latvia anyway, or anywhere else in Europe for that matter, right?

And let me ask you this, Ron--in a Britain ruled by the BNP, would I or my mother or my children or my granddaughter be welcome to visit or live in "their" country? Though my ancestry is mainly Celtic, English and German, I am also part Choctaw and Creek Indian, as are my mother, my son and my daughter, though you wouldn't know it to look at us--redheads all. My little granddaughter has my American Indian ancestry as well, not to mention a healthy dollop of Spanish, Carib Indian and black African ancestry to boot. Would the BNP look favorably on her as a visitor or even as a potential immigrant? When will the Racial Purity laws be passed? Should I still feel welcome as a member of POE? I'm not so sure right now. 

My great-grandmother, who was born in Germany, used to translate Hitler's speeches for my father that they picked up on a short-wave radio in Detroit during the 1930's. She made sure that my father (who eventually served in the American Army Air Force in WW II) was fully aware of the depth of Hitler's evil and depravity. I hear too many echoes of his twisted rhetoric in the speeches and press releases of the BNP--nicely sanitized, of course, for the British public. Make no mistake, though, they bear the seeds of hatred. 

I know . . . I'm an American who can't even spell certain English words properly, and as such I have no say in Britain's political future. I also want very much to believe, Ron, that the British people are much wiser than the BNP suspects--that they will refuse in the end to succumb to Beer Hall Putsch tactics and the politics of fear. It is very painful for me to see this strident rhetoric coming from such a respected POE leader as you. For the most part, you strike me as a humorous and very decent man who’d gladly give you the shirt off his back--someone with whom I wouldn't mind downing a couple of pints.

I just want to make the point that great fear is all too often accompanied by great evil, which consumes all that is humane and kind and rational. We are, after all, commanded to love our neighbors--not just the ones we like or the ones who are like us--ALL of our neighbors regardless of their creeds or color or origins.

There, I've had my say! Thanks for your patience. 

I think your posting was very eloquent, Rob.  I don't know too much about the BNP, but what little I've read reminds me, quite frankly, of the KKK.

I really don't want to enter the fray and hope I'm not doing so by posting in this thread.  And in what I said above about the BNP, I mean no offense to you Ron.  I've met Ron in person, Rob and he is 

humorous and very decent man who’d gladly give you the shirt off his back.

I wanted to answer the question you posed:

Do any of you reading this forum post believe that the Holocaust was an elaborate hoax?

When I was a teenager, I worked in the restaurant of a downtown department store and next to the store was an old hotel that had been converted into apartments for senior citizens.  I can't tell you how many of the seniors who lived there and came over to our restaurant to eat bore those tatoos.  It was heartbreaking.  Most of what I know about the Holocaust I learned from a great British series called, "The World at War," narrated by Sir Laurence Olivier.  The footage from the death camps COULD NOT have been faked.  Is this Nick Griffin the head of the BNP or something?  If he is, then his anti-Semitic remarks should make any intelligent person in Britain wake up and smell the coffee about what his agenda's all about.

Thanks for your comments dear friends. But you seem to miss the point, this stuff was being broadcast on BBC radio yesterday and I merely set up the thread as a point of discussion, being careful to quote as they did, which you have responded to. The fact that I think the BNP have changed and therefore could be good for Britain is another matter.

First of all, I want to make it perfectly clear that in no way do I feel that you, Ron, are a racist or a fascist. I believe that you are a caring and decent man who loves his country and his culture. I am, however, very concerned that you choose to insert the inflammatory rhetoric of the BNP into many of your posts. You certainly have a right to do so if you feel the need, but I and others also have the same right to disagree with the tenants of the BNP and take you to task for exposing us to that party's shrill and intolerant dogma (my opinion, anyway).

If nothing else, Ron, you've gotten people's blood moving, and that's a good thing. My fear is that I see Britain in kind of the same situation as the late Weimar Republic shortly before the election of Hitler as Chancellor of Germany. The economy was in shambles, lawlessness and social unrest were on the rise and suspicion of those considered "outsiders" in the Fatherland (Jews in this case) was intensifying. It was a "perfect storm" that drove many very good, honest, law-abiding ordinary citizens to support the most evil regime imaginable in order to create for themselves a false sense of security. I'm very concerned about this, Ron, because I also care deeply about Britain and I don't want to see it descend into the Hell that became the Third Reich. And I care about you as well. I don't want to minimize your own concerns over the current direction of the UK, but I have great concerns about the direction in which the BNP wants to take your country--and in my opinion that direction leads only toward the abyss.

 And yes, Ruth, Nick Griffin is the party leader of the BNP. Thank you for your post, and thanks also to Stephanie and Ron for your posts as well.

Thanks for responding again Rob, sorry I hadn't got around to specifically mentioning you yet, but it was something that I intended to do (other stuff on POE to do) so I hope this goes someway to explaining if you like, the slow reaction from me!

Your posts were long and very informative, some of which I was not aware, but like lots of other 'Brits' history is not a strong subject for me. I have said many times that others, in particular the American people are unbelieveably knowledgeable about our history, almost embarrassingly knowledgeable in fact!

Anyway, we are not really on a hunt for the best boy/girl in class for history are we? What you are trying to suggest I think, is that I have some undying support for the BNP but I can tell you that when I actually put my 'cross' in the box at the next General Election it will not be for Labour, Tory, Liberal or the BNP. It will in fact be for UKIP who have similar visions as the BNP although maybe not so abrasive! Do you have a problem with them also? I doubt it but if you do then here is the place to discuss them also.

The whole idea of starting these new threads is to create discussion, whether you like it or not. You may disagree, that is your prerogative but in fact it has thrown up a lot of useful information for others to read and learn from, myself included!

Where, when? What I have done is refer to the BNP. The very fact that their organization is being mentioned must be music to their ears, but more imortantly to me it has got people talking, got the blood moving as you say

>>>I and others also have the same right to disagree with the tenants of the BNP and take you to task for exposing us to that party's shrill and intolerant dogma.

I totally agree with you but the difference is, it is you who have got your 'knickers in a twist' so to speak for trying to shut me up! Further, where did I expose you to 'that party's shrill and intolerant dogma'?

>>>I have great concerns about the direction in which the BNP wants to take your country--and in my opinion that direction leads only toward the abyss.

That being the case this thread and discussion should help others to perhaps understand a little more about the BNP....good or bad!! Me? Well, as I said UKIP for me despite what I might suggest in any other threads, and yes I care immensely about our beautiful country.

Remember, I purposely comment the way I do to instigate discussion in the forum. Anyway, I am still happy to have a beer or two with you...........as long as you are paying!! Lol

>>>Where, when? What I have done is refer to the BNP. The very fact that their organization is being mentioned must be music to their ears, but more imortantly to me it has got people talking, got the blood moving as you say

 Well, the title of this thread for starters--sure caught my attention! Though it may not have come from the BNP directly, it's tone is certainly in keeping with their rhetoric. And rest assured that I am not trying to shut you up . . . on the contrary, I hope you continue to express your heartfelt beliefs!

 I'm glad that this discussion is happening. I understand your concerns here--I just believe that there are more positive ways to approach the problems that your country faces than what the BNP has to offer. As to the UKIP, although I am aware of this party, I'm afraid I don't know enough about them to offer an opinion.

 And as to who might be paying for those future pints--I'm thinking trial by ordeal (that's the medievalist in me)!

Huh, you pay then Rob!

Sounds like it might be an ordeal to get you to pay!! Lol

Incidentally, just in case you missed it the thread title was as it came across on BBC radio (The Jeremy Vine Show).